LSU's Defense Is On Pace for Historic Levels
by Year2 on Oct 10, 2011 11:33 AM EDT
in SEC Football
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PrintI wanted to find some way to explain just how good LSU's new-look defense has been this season. I was a bit down on the Tigers prior to the season because they lost the best player from each level in Drake Nevis, Kelvin Sheppard, and Patrick Peterson. Obviously, that pessimism was unwarranted.
The first place I looked was to rushing defense. I remember seeing somewhere a while ago that LSU's rushing yards allowed per game had been rising every year since the 2007 national championship season. That is correct: LSU allowed 106.10 yards per game in '07, 110.15 in '08, 133.38 in '09, and 137.31 in '10. I hate the NCAA rushing stats though, as they count sacks as runs. Besides, yards per carry is better than yards per game.
So I looked into rushing yards with sacks removed, and I was blown away. I then threw in the passing defense, and the picture gets even uglier for LSU's opponents:
| Season | Carries | Yards | YPC | Comp/Att | Pct. | Yards | Yds/Att | TD | INT | Pass Eff. |
| 2007 | 427 | 1767 | 4.14 | 212/451 | 47.0% | 2558 | 5.67 | 19 | 23 | 98.35 |
| 2008 | 393 | 1604 | 4.08 | 227/425 | 53.4% | 2800 | 6.59 | 15 | 8 | 116.64 |
| 2009 | 473 | 1879 | 3.97 | 222/416 | 53.4% | 2525 | 6.07 | 13 | 13 | 108.41 |
| 2010 | 444 | 2050 | 4.62 | 196/344 | 57.0% | 2208 | 6.42 | 15 | 19 | 114.24 |
| 2011 | 169 | 484 | 2.86 | 117/214 | 54.7% | 1109 | 5.18 | 5 | 8 | 98.44 |
In terms of yards per carry, LSU's defense was marginally better than 2007 in the following two years, though it got noticeably worse last year. This year? Ho-lee crap. LSU is holding opponents under three yards per carry so far. Keep in mind that one of those opponents was Oregon, the nation's current leader in YPC at 7.37 (two sacks included, so it's actually marginally higher). The Ducks officially managed just 3.4 YPC against LSU, and there wasn't even a sack to help that number. Think about how much higher Oregon's season figure would be had it not faced LSU.
So as it turns out, pass defense and not rush defense was the real area where the subsequent years weren't up to the 2007 standard. Opponents' yards per pass, completion percentage, and passing efficiency were all up in 2008-10 over '07. Passing TDs were down, yes, but INTs weren't as high.
This year's completion percentage is also higher than 2007's impossibly low figure, but the yards per attempt is actually half a yard lower. Those competing factors even each other out essentially in producing the passing efficiency figures that are basically the same. Keep in mind that LSU also has faced West Virginia, one of the nation's most prolific passing teams. Geno Smith is 29th in passing efficiency at 152.38 despite his 122.3 against the Tigers.
So far, LSU is sporting a rough equivalent to its best recent passing defense along with by far its best rushing defense. We'll see what Arkansas and Alabama do to those numbers, but LSU will probably sustain its pace this weekend with Tyler Bray out for Tennessee. John Chavis has everything put together just right in Baton Rouge this season.
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Maybe historic by LSU's standards
But Bama’s defense is better than LSU’s in every single statistical category except sacks, and in most cases markedly better.
http://web1.ncaa.org/mfb/2011/Internet/conf%20stats/2011000000911TD.HTML
I knew this response was coming
And I don’t care. This was about comparing LSU to LSU, not to anyone else.
Team Speed Kills -- SBNation's SEC Blog
If you're so inclined, follow me @Year2
I think he's quibbling with the headline.
Your definition of “historic” in that context is different from what most would perceive it to mean.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
And you have to get all of two paragraphs in to discover the context of the piece.
Team Speed Kills -- SBNation's SEC Blog
If you're so inclined, follow me @Year2
And if you don't want predictable, unneccessary comments
maybe you should reconsider more detail in your headlines. The the people who lack the time or brain power to read the entire article will not post obvious troll bait.
"If wanting to win is a fault, as some of my critics seem to insist, then I plead guilty. I like to win. I know no other way. It's in my blood." -- Paul "Bear" Bryant
by GeauxCrimson on Oct 10, 2011 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
If people who don’t read want to make themselves look bad, that’s their prerogative.
Team Speed Kills -- SBNation's SEC Blog
If you're so inclined, follow me @Year2
by Year2 on Oct 10, 2011 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
i agree with this..
at first i was like “Huh?” Then i read it understood where you were coming from. I thought it was a good read. I love seeing stats from one year to the next. So many different factors come into comparing one year to the next but its still fun to look at them.
Follow on twitter @thelyell
Historic?
Five years of comparison establishes historic? I know you’re trying to defend the point you’re making, but noting that LSU’s defense this year is their best in past five years 1) isn’t exactly a revelation and 2) doesn’t meet any meaningful standard of use for the word historic.
dude, if you don't want
controversy, then don’t write uncontroversial articles!
by Mark Mandingo on Oct 10, 2011 2:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I fail to understand
why LSU having the best LSU defense of the last 5 years of LSU football is news on a website that purports to cover the entire conference.
I wasn't quite sure
so I checked. Suspicions confirmed: LSU is still in the SEC.
"If wanting to win is a fault, as some of my critics seem to insist, then I plead guilty. I like to win. I know no other way. It's in my blood." -- Paul "Bear" Bryant
by GeauxCrimson on Oct 10, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions
then I can't wait
for posts here comparing this year’s UT running game to historical UT offenses, or UK’s kick returns this year (I’m sure they’ve had plenty) to other UK teams. Or, this conference-wide blog could leave such internal comparisons up to the team-specific blogs and not waste its time considering something that is only newsworthy to a single fanbase.
/Iwantmymoneyback
I get what you are saying
but this is the SEC where defense is a big deal. LSU’s defense is a big topic in national media right now. So he merely pointed out that it’s not JUST media hype (cuz LSU has NNNEEEVVVVEEERRRR been helped by that cough 2007 cough, it actually has some merit to all the hooplah.
"If wanting to win is a fault, as some of my critics seem to insist, then I plead guilty. I like to win. I know no other way. It's in my blood." -- Paul "Bear" Bryant
by GeauxCrimson on Oct 10, 2011 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions
It's a conspiracy, PAAAWWWWWLLL
Someone didn’t mentioned Alabama once in an article about LSU!
You have been mad and drunken, furious and wild, filled with hatred and despair...but so have we - Thomas Wolfe, inadvertently commenting on college football.
Makes zero sense
Everyone knows all the SEC conspiracies are to HELP Bama. If we wanted to be in this article, the REC would have made it happen!
"If wanting to win is a fault, as some of my critics seem to insist, then I plead guilty. I like to win. I know no other way. It's in my blood." -- Paul "Bear" Bryant
by GeauxCrimson on Oct 10, 2011 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Note on the 2010 defense
The season-ending stats were completely thrown off by the extreme outlier of the 440-yards allowed to Auburn. That game alone raised the per-game yardage average from 112 to 157.
Writer (and a handsome one at that),
And the Valley Shook
And likewise, look at LSU's passing yardage figures this season per game
240, 99, 141, 463, 66, 100
One of those things is not like the others.
Writer (and a handsome one at that),
And the Valley Shook
by Billy Gomila on Oct 10, 2011 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well,
the 99, 141, 66, and 100 were against the following passing offenses: FCS, #89, #116, and #98 (playing their third QB.) The #4 passing offense, WVU, actually gained 83 yards more than their average vs. LSU. Oregon, ranked #62, outgained their average slightly as well. Matthieu has made some awesome plays, but does he take undue risks that leave the secondary exposed sometimes?
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
The accompanying passer ratings should answer your question
97.15, 80.40, 91.38, 122.29, 63.38 and 104.38.
WVU and Oregon got yards, but it came at a pronounced lack of efficiency in doing so. Their team passer ratings are both well in the 150s.
Writer (and a handsome one at that),
And the Valley Shook
by Billy Gomila on Oct 10, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Wouldn't that suggest big plays though?
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
Not really
Oregon averaged 4.4 yards per attempt. WVU averaged 7.1 but that’s still under their average. They had 3 long scoring drives out of 15 possessions, but the other 12 drives averaged about 24 yards per and all ended with a punt, a turnover or the end of the half.
Writer (and a handsome one at that),
And the Valley Shook
by Billy Gomila on Oct 10, 2011 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Oregon in particular
Benefited from a late scoring drive well after the game was decided. Went 70 yards in 11 plays and scored TD with 13 seconds. The game was essentially over, but they finished with 27 points and 335 yards instead of 20 points and 265 yards.
Writer (and a handsome one at that),
And the Valley Shook
by Billy Gomila on Oct 10, 2011 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions
WVU is really the only one that matters.
Anybody who’s watched Thomas at Oregon knows he’s not a great passer and the others are all awful. That said, if you compare what WVU did against LSU to what Arkansas, statistically a slightly better passing offense than WVU, did against Bama, I think you have to give the edge to Bama in that area (not that you were comparing, but hell, any chance to unzip and break out the ruler.)
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
Bama's pass defense has been slightly better
Its pretty close, but whether you’re holding teams to an 85 passer rating or a 98 one, you’re playing some pretty good pass D.
Writer (and a handsome one at that),
And the Valley Shook
by Billy Gomila on Oct 10, 2011 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep.
And of the two we have the less-experienced QB.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
View from Death Valley. The LSU D
Hell, the whole TEAM, is the biggest, fastest, strongest group of players in the country. Period.
Both sides of the ball don’t really seem to have any sort of discernible “scheme” or “system” so it’s difficult to call them “well coached” other than admitting Les Miles is smart in his own way, and knows exactly how to hurt you most. The man is an insane genius of special teams coaching.
The only way to beat this team (unless you are the Patriots or the Packers) is to scheme against their weaknesses. What are those weaknesses? Hell if I know. You won’t be able to use speed against them; they’re faster than you. You won’t out-muscle them; they’re stronger than you. I thought Charlie Weis, if anyone, might be able to find a weakness or two in their defense. But again – no scheme, not much predictable about what will get thrown at you. Hard to game plan for that.
Have to acknowledge that Tommy Moffitt is THE BEST S&C coach in the country – that is the only consistent piece of the LSU puzzle. It sure ain’t Kragthorpe or Crowton. Chavis is obviously pretty good but is he the secret? How does LSU keep this revolving door of world-beating players churning year-in and year-out without missing a step? All strength & conditioning.
I'm not going to a country that confuses itself with poultry. Never.
wow...im pretty sure ive heard everything you just said but
coming from a Bama fan talking about Alabama….Including the S&C coach part…
You do know y’all played against a 3rd string QB on Saturday thanks to Bama and that you’ll be playing another back up against UT?..You do also know you gave up huge numbers to WVU as well..Not saying your D isn’t good, cause it is but don’t forget its not unbeatable..Every defense is, uncluding Bama’s.
Follow on twitter @thelyell
You do know
you’re talking to a Florida fan, right?
I'm not going to a country that confuses itself with poultry. Never.
by Bourbon_Meyer on Oct 10, 2011 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions
doesn't really matter...still holds true..
Bama’s D and LSU’s D are so similar its scary…
Follow on twitter @thelyell
well the only thing i havent heard is the
scheme part…Saban has a clear scheme on both sides of the ball..other than that..Yep..pretty much the same.
Follow on twitter @thelyell
yea, minor difference
between having a scheme and just out muscling everyone.
Sorry I commented something longer than two sentences without complimenting Ablamamma. I realize that doesn’t happen often so I can see how you were insulted.
I'm not going to a country that confuses itself with poultry. Never.
by Bourbon_Meyer on Oct 10, 2011 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions
id rather have a Scheme than just muscle..Or how about both?
schemes can adjust..If your muscle meets muscle than the team who is more schematically sound wins.
Oh and you can go 10000000000000000000000000 words with never complimenting Alabama..I just wanted to point out that your observations are incorrect. Hands down the Bama win against UF was more complete, impressive and dominating that LSU’s. All you have to do is look at who played in the game, where it was played and the stat line to know that..
Follow on twitter @thelyell
Ain't neither of us
gonna win this one. I’ll wait for Nov. 5th and see if Nick can find the weaknesses that Charlie couldn’t.
I'm not going to a country that confuses itself with poultry. Never.
by Bourbon_Meyer on Oct 10, 2011 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
agreed...
Though I think Weis saw something because UF had better stats against LSU than Bama. Also the fact that LSU gave up something like 400+ yards to WVU has to say something..I also think had Brantley played in the game it would have been a lot closer. No i don’t think UF wins but the game is closer. I actually kinda feel bad that UF had to play both teams back to back..
Now UT? Those sorry bastards deserve the ass whoopin that is coming in the next two weeks.
Follow on twitter @thelyell
by bammer on Oct 10, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
REC'D FOR VILE HATE
"If wanting to win is a fault, as some of my critics seem to insist, then I plead guilty. I like to win. I know no other way. It's in my blood." -- Paul "Bear" Bryant
by GeauxCrimson on Oct 10, 2011 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
If I were trying to defend LSU to the death....
I’d say that LSU (including the coaches) totally took the foot off the proverbial pedal in the 3rd quarter. Playing a 3rd string running back? Against UF? Starting in the second half? That’s a little light.
I almost feel bad for UF as well…but they laid 50 on LSU a few years back, and I thought LSU wasn’t trying to run up the score this game, so I don’t feel as bad.
But I think we can all agree that this argument is much quicker, more productive, and likely more enjoyable for only one of us on November 5th. Here’s to a good, well-officiated, injury free game.
Devery Henderson, making absurd grabs for my teams since 2001.
by Andrew Tessier on Oct 10, 2011 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions
WHO ARE YOU
and why do you claim to be an LSU fan? Too much rationality, does not compute.
"If wanting to win is a fault, as some of my critics seem to insist, then I plead guilty. I like to win. I know no other way. It's in my blood." -- Paul "Bear" Bryant
by GeauxCrimson on Oct 10, 2011 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Don’t forget how LSU has feasted on turnovers this year. Those are just killing their opponents, forcing them to play from behind and fueling LSU’s fire.
The only pause I give LSU’s defense is the +500 yard night against WV. Hard for me to see the best D in the country allowing that to happen.
I was looking forward to how Bray and Co. would match up with the Tigers, but now that he’s injured it’ll be a blowout.
WVU had 3 long drives
But the other 12 possessions didn’t really go that far and ended with a punt, turnover or the end of the half.
Writer (and a handsome one at that),
And the Valley Shook
by Billy Gomila on Oct 10, 2011 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Sorry – the post below was meant to go here.
by Bryant Denny on Oct 10, 2011 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Dang, that’s a lot of drives. Three of the 12 were turnovers and that goes back to my point of turnovers killing your opponents. But that’s the name of the game, though.
if you throw the ball 65 times or whatever against LSU
You will turn the ball over, and the yardage total will be pretty irrelevant. Alabama will not do that, obviously, but WVU just decided to sling it and they made too many mistakes.
You have been mad and drunken, furious and wild, filled with hatred and despair...but so have we - Thomas Wolfe, inadvertently commenting on college football.
Well, just because you sling the ball around doesn’t mean you should throw for +400 yards. That’s one reason I was interested to see Bray against LSU.
by Bryant Denny on Oct 11, 2011 9:08 AM EDT up reply actions
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